We should look at the original Arabic for word though to fully understand. As Suleyman Dost observes, The Qurns reference to rock-cut dwellings fits the picture perfectly with the exception that these carved niches do not seem to have functioned as living areas3, Returning to textual references, Diodorus, a Greek historian writing in the first century BC, mentions a group called Thamoudnoi in North-Western Arabia4. Its also implausible that a people who would be at the helm of such epic architectural and engineering achievements would not even make mention of it, or at least keep a record of it. In other words either the evidence no longer exists (no problem) or Thamudic dwellings in North West Arabia are yet to be discovered. The arguments against the Quran and Hadith are as follows: Al-Hijr Archaeological Site (Madin Slih) UNESCO World Heritage Centre. _ Story of Aad _tafseer. It is addressed there Beni Hassan defeated both Berbers and Black Africans in the region, pushing them southwards to the Senegal river while the Arab tribes settled in Mauritania. Here is the summary of his opinion: ( ) which only proves that al-Hijr was also the land of the Thamud which is not a problem. It makes it specific but is not related to time. The Quran and Sunnah do not identify any specific existing ruins as belonging to the first ancient tribe of Thamud, although some Muslim historians and popular folklore have done so. Ive discussed this more below. During this time, the Nabateans built structures out of rock throughout their Kingdom, The buildings are not homes but are actually tombs, The inscriptions in al-Hijr are not those made by Thamud , At 26 instances in the Quran Thamud are mentioned by name and in none of those contexts they have been called People of al-Hijr, Where the carvings done by Thamud are mentioned the place of it is also mentioned, Quran 89:9 where the places is mentioned as al-Wad which means Wad lQura, The carvings made by the people of al-Hijr are mentioned in 15:82 and the people of al-Hijr is a title of the Nabateans. To Aad was sent the prophet Hud; to Thamud, Saleh, and together with another mysterious figure, Shoaib, they constitute the only three pre-Islamic prophets mentioned in the Quran that have an exclusive Arab provenance. The tribes of Arabia descend from either one of the two Arab ancestors, Adnan or Qahtan. Khawiya seems to mean destroyed/overturned but the term could possibly mean ruined too. The shout, which is an extremely loud sound, might have caused the earthquake, according to certain scholars. They are mentioned in the Quran as examples of civilizations that Allah had destroyed because of their sins and as signs of the fleeting nature of the worldly power. Moreover, they cultivated fertile land and gained lots of benefit from it. We find ruins of so many past civilisations such as Indus Valley (Mohenjodaro, Harappa), Sodom, and so on. After the destruction of Ad, Thamud succeeded them in power and grandeur. They lived in the kingdom of Edom, which is about 200 or so miles from Madian Saleh, where, supposedly, the Quranic Thamud lived, although the Thamud could have lived in multiple areas, including Petra 3. Abul Ala Maududi. But I digress. Five Syriac inscriptions mentioning Arabs have been found at Sumatar Harabesi, one of which dates to the 2nd century CE. Allah sent a powerful windstorm to the Aad that destroyed them and left them sprawled and mangled in their homes. The Middle verse in chapter (25) of the Noble Quran talks about Noah's people, Ad (the people of the prophet Hud) and Thamud (the people of the prophet Salih). Qur'anic accounts of Salih always follow those of Hud. As regarding to the Ahadith from Ibn Umar (as), they seem to be a interpretation of him itself, the prophet (as) says nothing about them. - _ tafseer. Another inscription from the same temple mentions Aad by name, and reads, by Ghawth son of Aslah son of Thokam and he constructed the temple of Allt, of the people of Ad. Perhaps these survivors were Prophet Hud (AS) and his followers. In sura 15, there seems to be a chronological order: At first the story of Adam (as) is mentioned (26-50), then the story of Abraham (as) and Lot (as) (51-77), then the story of the people of al-Rass,i.e. The Nabataean alphabet was adopted by Arabs to the south, and evolved into modern Arabic script around the 4th century. They were elites. you who live in the clefts of the rocks[a] 41.13-18 Kathir - Ibn Al Kathir. Theyre mentioned in 25:38 and 50:12. Finally, we should understand that Allah has no problem replacing one people with another. Assalam alikum so is 89:9 present tense or past tense the altheana jabbu al sakrah bilwadi bit and you are saying that the thamud dwellings have gone destroyed after the prophets time, And Is madain al saleh wadi alQura or is wadi alqura some where else, And do you think there houses were destroyed before or after ibn kathir and could the land of thamud be petra ir yemon because there is a town called thamud in yemon, And does 27:52 mean there dwellings were destroyed or empty and could 89:9 mean there dwellings just of been caves in the prophets the outside gone fallen if you know what I mean and can. Again the burden of proof is on us that this was the case. I would rather think that the Thamud were more like two or three hundred years after the Aad. This implies that the carvings in Madain Saleh (which in fact date to the first century CE) are not from the Thamudians, but rather their successors many centuries later in the same area. Before the destruction came to them, Hud and his small group of followers escaped the area and were spared the punishment. There is no possibility that these were houses. Source: Sahih Muslim 2981, Grade: Sahih, . from there I will bring you down, But unlike most of the others, these two stand out for not having any clear counterpart in the Judeo-Christian tradition a wellspring of Middle Eastern traditions, of which Islam draws in so small measure. In addition, when the verses talk about Verily there is a sign in this, it doesnt necessarily mean that we have to see the sign i.e. Have not invested any considerable time investigating the actual archeological claims. . Allah knows best if that really happened (this event is not mentioned in the Quran or Sunnah.). Is Thamud mentioned in the Bible? Al does not make anything past or present or future. Saudi Arabia, in terms of archaeology, is really untouched. Many centuries elapse before we find Thamud again in the textual record, though their name crops up many times in (undated) inscriptions throughout North Arabia. Is there a possibility that these remaining tombs (around 1400 years back, were more in number and had dwellings as well) were inscribed upon by the Nabataeans as has already been proposed and I came across a while back, Assalam alikum what about 40:21 and 40:82 if someone could explain these verses, Walikum Assalam, Nabateans replaced them and built on them/around them, 4. 74], , And certainly did the companions of Thamud deny the messengers. 13. Revisionists are conspiracy theorists and conspiracy theories sell so in order to make quick money and get fame, some western pseudo scholars propagate this absurd conspiracy theory. Yes, the Thamd denied their Lordso away with the Thamd! Possible answer: Their messenger lived before or even during the time of Isa (as), this also the time where this site flourished, but when they denied him, Allah did not destroy them immidiantely. [15], But despite the presence of a tribe called the Thamud as late as the fourth century, sixth-century Arab poets whose works are preserved in post-Islamic sources were already referring to the Thamud as an ancient and long-lost tribe whose very name recalled the transience of all things. A report in the hadith collection of Bukhari makes this connection between Thamud and al-Hijr quite explicit. Several other inscriptions bearing the namesAad and Iram have been discovered in Jordan. These people were very wealthy and wielded great power. The Quran tells us that the people of Ad started to build altars on the high places, and even strongholds in the mountains. What else do you have in mind [18] According to the Quran, the Thamud were the successors of a previous nation called the d, who had also been destroyed for their sins. Four generations is only about eighty years and its unlikely, in my humble opinion, that they were able to establish a new socieity, invent a new religion, and forget all about their ancestors the Aad in such a short time. Having similar names doesnt mean much [4] This entire passage has been sent by Sharif. Since I dont have my own blog currently, I will post it here, in case it helps anyone. On this Wikipedia the language links are at the top of the page across from the article title. The glorious Qur'an considered the people of 'Ad after Nuh (a); when it says, "and that it is He who destroyed the former 'Ad", "The former 'Ad" were the people of Prophet Hud (a) who lived after the people of Nuh (a) and before the people of Thamud. Allah doesnt need you. But the shriek seized them at early morning. [20] The Arabs of the caliphate accommodated many new tribes in isolated areas to avoid conflict with the locals; caliph Uthman ordered his governor, Muawiyah I, to settle the new tribes away from the original population. I look forward to your response my dear brother. Source: Sahih Muslim 2980, Grade: Sahih. When actual tribe of thamud perished it was the Amorites who are from Prophet Saleh pbuh, they are the original Hebrews. That they were better than you in building these fallen down relics 2. God then destroyed the tribe, except for Salih and a few other righteous men. Between the mountains were valleys with gardens and springs of water. The first ancient tribe of Thamud should be distinguished from later tribes named Thamud by historians and archaeologists, as well as the region itself, which was known as the land of Thamud and sometimes simply Thamud.. A number of them branched out, which later became independent tribes (sub-tribes). The general consensus among 14th-century Arab genealogists is that Arabs are of three kinds: . . These prefixes ignored in the alphabetical ordering: Al, Al-Bu, Albu, Banu. Thats it. More than a century after Jesus, in the reign of the Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius (d. 180 AD), we find that a part of the Thamud tribe was enrolled in the Roman army. The account presented in Surah an-Naml also mentions nine evil people of Thamud who are immediately responsible for God's punishment of their people[Quran27:4851] in a narrative reminiscent of Jewish descriptions of the demise of Sodom. Have you not considered how your Lord dealt with Aad; of Iram of the lofty pillars? (Quran 89:6-7). 85 percent of the region is still untouched, and hidden. Summary: The cravings that Quran says were done by Thamud were in Wad l-Qura. Before the destruction came to them, Hud and his followers seems mean... 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